Beebase has a list of EU based queen imports
http://www.nationalbeeunit.com/publi...portReport.cfm
Beebase has a list of EU based queen imports
http://www.nationalbeeunit.com/publi...portReport.cfm
Hi JonOriginally Posted by Jon
That's very interesting
Am I reading that right
Most of the queens come from Greece, Slovenia and Denmark?
Most of the package bees come from Italy ? the (home of the European small hive beetle )
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its hopelessly inaccurate. Although they SHOULD all be reported, most EU shipments just arrive in the post or airmail. They have certificates with them if done properly, but many many shipments are not on that list. The beekeeper has to do the reporting, and several I can think of just don't bother. The import is legal and correctly documented, just not reported on to beebase.
I agree it's hopelessly inaccurate. It would be interesting to know just how inaccurate, what proportion are done properly, and what proportion of those get recorded. I fancy at least 50% of small consignments don't trouble the scorers and a good number of larger lots too. I doubt anyone really has a handle on it.
Just trying to get my head around this. I'd previously thought that failure to report the imminent arrival of a consignment makes it illegal whether it has full documentation to that point or not. Quite surprised that's not actually the case.
This quote from BeeBase shows that importing without declaring it in advance to the authorities is indeed an illegal act. Their bolding, not mine.
http://www.nationalbeeunit.com/index.cfm?sectionid=47
Imports
It is a legal requirement that you notify the National Bee Unit of imports of bees from outside the UK. You can do this by completing the Importer Notification Form and posting, faxing or emailing it to us. Alternatively you can log in to the Beekeeper pages of BeeBase and click the 'Import Notifications' link from the left hand index.
The legal way is that the exporter (within the EU) obtains a health certificate and the exporting country enters the data into the TRACES system. The receiving country should be notified by the importer and the two sets of records match up. In theory this gives traceability if 'something happens' .... for example SHB being found in the country of origin allowed detailed inspections of the apiaries of those beekeepers who had worked within the system. Those acting illegally could not be traced and inspected, a scandalous state of affairs in my view.
Yes, but the real world does not quite operate that way. Are you going to set up some kind of surveillance system on every beekeeper and open all their mail to look for bees being imported, or search their vehicles at ports, or their baggage at airports? We have to be aware of our UNimportance. Within the bee community we can get all animated and jump up and down like Zebedee as much as we like. Those who would have to fund draconian border controls over bees will think they have far more serious matters to expend their resources on.
The matching up bit gives real issues at times.
1. The shipper comes up short at source, or ships a few extra. Do you gas the bees as the papers no longer match? In theory that is what should happen if they are caught in transit and it says on the papers you should have 400 units but only have say 312.
2. As is the custom of the trade from several origins, you order 400, get papers for 400, and then you find the shipper has put in 408. 2% overship, or even 4% from some provenances, is quite common, to cover for losses in transit. By the system that is illegal.
3. You order 400 queens from an EU breeder. You notify the UK that you believe them to be coming on a certain date. The breeder cannot deliver (commonplace, esp in the UK) as ordered, and sends multiple smaller shipments over a protracted period and still comes up short.....I am sure anyone with any depth of experience has met this.......then its still illegal.
There are several parts of the UK where disease is common and there is no official presale inspection I would be far more worried about than professionally produced and well inspected and certificated product of breeders the other side of the channel.
Last edited by Calluna4u; 20-12-2015 at 01:41 PM.
You are correct. My wording was not as good as it should have been. I should have re rad what I typed rather than fire it off. The words 'with the exception of being' should have been in the middle of the last sentence, rather than 'just not'. It is also the case that it should be prenotified rather than after the event. For queen shipments it is often not done. For packages? Well until this year not too many of the shipments showed up. This year better, but still not perfect by a long way.
However, and I aint going into this hair splitting but from the wording you quote its not clear if this renders such a shipment 'illegal' or 'not legal'. Apparently they are very different things.
Last edited by Calluna4u; 20-12-2015 at 01:40 PM.
That's quite possibly the case and it's not something I'd want to get involved in discussing either.
If unreported imports are as common as repeatedly stated on here then there's plainly no urgency for a clamp down, compare this to a post by SDM a few weeks ago where he told us of a local bee inspector, giving a talk at their local club, clearly stating that they were being instructed to "come down hard" on people continuing to use unlicenced oxalic mixtures.
Last edited by prakel; 20-12-2015 at 02:12 PM.
As always, some interesting points raised by Calluna4u.
With regard to final consignment being +/- the expected (stated) number, do you think that the people that you've heard of who fail to report their imports would look differently at the paperwork if there was facility to make the pre-arrival declaration but then to have an 'ammendments' window of a couple of days to clear up any discrepencies. Probably too simple a solution where government paperwork is concerned, of course.
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