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Thread: Artificial swarm (Ian Craig)

  1. #11
    Member susbees's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EmsE View Post
    Hi susbees, the insulation is still in place in January (it is put in place in November). The matchsticks are used for ventilation purposes because of the solid floors but are removed in mid feb to help conserve the heat to help with brood rearing.
    Ah, ok, found the insulation: but also found that he doesn't like OMF as he considers that the wind sweeps in...simple solution being to put a spare super under the floor for winter (which I'm pretty sure I got off a Scottish leaflet at some point). I'm grateful for every mite that falls out the bottom of my OMFs . Meanwhile as warm air rises it seeps out from the gap at the top with matchsticks reducing the good done by the insulation.

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    He seems to be in the minority on Solid floors. Asked a few people who used to use solid floors and have since switched to OMFs whether they'd go back to solid if Varroa disappeared tomorrow. None of them would

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    Senior Member Mellifera Crofter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gavin View Post
    Demaree!

    Graeme Sharpe described his use of the Demaree on Monday in Dundee (amongst many other things) ...
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    ... I have used various methods of swarm control. I tend to mix and match depending on what equipment I have available and what I want to achieve.
    I have cut and pasted the basic Demaree method that I use ...
    I have also heard Graeme explaining the Demaree method a year or so ago, but I glazed over with incomprehension (and lost his notes). I'm reading and rereading your instructions, Jimbo, but I still don't quite get it. What happens to the emerging drones? Won't they become trapped above the queen excluder? Aren't the Snelgrove and Horsley methods kinder to the drones? What are the advantages of the Demaree method over the other two?

    Kitta

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    Member susbees's Avatar
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    The idea with Demaree is that you can keep moving frames up and down between the boxes all season if you want without messing up the honey crop and needing more space and extra equipment. Just keep dealing with any cells.

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    Administrator gavin's Avatar
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    Jimbo's description is similar to Graeme's leaflet - a few subtle differences but I doubt that they are important. Drones? Yes, Graeme's leaflet suggests just opening up the top box from time to time to let them out (nice to see drone compassion here and there!).

    What advantage is carried by the Demaree method? I'd guess simplicity and adaptability, but then I never paid much attention to the Snelgrove and Horsely methods.

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    Senior Member Jon's Avatar
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    When you use a 2 box queenright queenrearing system it is essentially a Demaree system and I find that my cell raising colonies rarely make a natural queen cell as the queen always has a box of drawn foundation to lay in and is never cramped for style.
    It's a curious business, as the colony can produce 100 queen cells for you in the top box yet it makes no attempt to swarm.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Mellifera Crofter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by susbees View Post
    The idea with Demaree is that you can keep moving frames up and down between the boxes all season if you want without messing up the honey crop and needing more space and extra equipment. Just keep dealing with any cells.
    Quote Originally Posted by gavin View Post
    ...What advantage is carried by the Demaree method? I'd guess simplicity and adaptability ...
    Can one make a little eke with an entrance to allow the drones their freedom? But I suppose that introduces extra equipment and they may decide to swarm through this entrance if we've missed a queencell.

    If the queen is separated from the main broodbox at the top by one or two supers, does one really need a queen excluder? Is she likely to march up over the super or supers to get to the top box? The drones will then be free.

    I've just read an old post by Jon from May 2010 warning that there must be drawn comb in the brood box if the bees have access to honey combs because, if not, the workers will polish the honey combs to make space for the queen. So, I suppose if it is feasible to do what I've just suggested, then one must bear that in mind.

    Jon's post is here:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    I have noticed that when you do this the bees tend to move into the super where the comb is already drawn and will be reluctant to draw more than a couple of frames of foundation down below. Bees may be smart - but they are not smart enough to know that a queen excluder lives up to its name so they will polish cells for the queen to lay in up in the super as it sure beats drawing foundation.
    Kitta

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    Senior Member Mellifera Crofter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    When you use a 2 box queenright queenrearing system it is essentially a Demaree system and I find that my cell raising colonies rarely make a natural queen cell as the queen always has a box of drawn foundation to lay in and is never cramped for style.
    It's a curious business, as the colony can produce 100 queen cells for you in the top box yet it makes no attempt to swarm.
    Jon, what does your 2-box system look like?

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    Hi Mellifera Crofter,

    When I use the Demaree I still have to check the old queen that she is not making further queen cells. I am therefore stripping down the hive approx every week and the drones are released. The mistake when I used to do Demaree was after I had done the split I thought that was it but in some cases the queen would still produce queen cells and swarm. I changed to using Ian Craigs version of a split board therfore the release of drones is not a problem. I tend to use the split board when I am producing a new queen but use the Demaree if I want to keep the hive strong for honey production. You could still use the Demaree if you want to produce queen cells for Nucs but I tend to use the split board

  10. #20
    Senior Member Jon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mellifera Crofter View Post
    Can one make a little eke with an entrance to allow the drones their freedom?
    You could do that but you will probably get a problem with brace comb.
    Some people just bore a little hole in the top box to let the drones escape.
    They are attracted to the light.
    I find that the drones escape anyway when I remove the crownboard of the top box.

    Jon, what does your 2-box system look like?
    It is a normal set up with the queen in the bottom box which is covered by an excluder.
    The supers, if any, go above this and the top box on top of the supers.
    I often put a second excluder over the supers and below the top box as insurance, as this prevents a virgin queen which hatches early in the top box from getting down into the supers. Having said that, it is bad practice to let a virgin queen escape as you should put rollers over the cells 48 hours before hatch date.

    With a Demaree system you must be able to find your queen every 10 days or so when you rearrange the frames from top to bottom as you have to keep her in the bottom box.

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