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Thread: Teaching beginners: Beehives.

  1. #11
    Senior Member Mellifera Crofter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris View Post
    I wish someone had pointed out to me the possibility and potential of *one size box* hives.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nellie View Post
    ... I think when it comes to discussing various hives it's very hard to keep your own personal opinion out of it. I totally get why commercial guys tend to take the one size fits all approach and why the rose hive might seem attractive as a result but I personally think it's a compromise when aimed at the hobbyist. ...
    I do agree with Chris. I am in the process of changing to a one-box system and it felt like a kind of liberation - and I'm definitely not commercial, Nellie. I'm still on the beginner side of being a beekeeper (a Basic Beemaster beginner). Perhaps it's the size of the box that matters. I'm changing to polystyrene medium Langstroths and they're fairly easy to handle. I also hope to build a Warré this winter, and compare them.

  2. #12
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    Glad you found a system that works for you MC. I'm very much not trying to set out with an aim to say "This is how you should keep bees and the hive type you should keep them in". In my opinion, for my bees, a medium langstroth isn't big enough so I'd have to go double brood which is something I really don't enjoy which is my sole objection to using a single box size: To get a big enough brood box to not have to double brood would mean having honey supers that were very heavy for me to lift on my own. In some respects that's pretty much the crux of my conclusion. Whatever hive type and configuration you choose, it's a compromise between what's best for the bees and what's best for you as a beekeeper. What's best for me isn't necessarily best for you.

    Now I've poked the nest a bit I've gone from wondering how to fill and hour and a half to wondering how I'm going to fit it all in

    What I very much want to try and do is set out the options, look at the differences and considerations that arise when it comes to choosing a hive type. My lazy opinion is "go National", but that's not very interesting or entertaining :-D If I was starting again, and hadn't inherited a big pile of national kit, my inclination would be to have used Langstroths rather than National/14x12 hives but all things considered, I get on pretty well with my 14x12s

  3. #13
    Senior Member Mellifera Crofter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mellifera Crofter View Post
    I do agree with Chris. I am in the process of changing to a one-box system and it felt like a kind of liberation - ...
    I'm changing my mind about a one-box system. Fine when the colony is small, but a bit of a time-consuming nightmare when large and potentially too many squashed bees. I suppose I made the situation worse by not using a queen excluder - but I now think that, either with or without a queen excluder, this is not a bee-friendly or beekeeper-friendly system.

    I did not know anybody using Langstroth all-mediums, so I suppose this was the only way for me to find out about them - but I now have to decide between Nationals, or Langstroth all-mediums and sort out this problem.

    Kitta

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    Administrator gavin's Avatar
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    What is it you don't like about the Langstroth mediums? Thick walls on the polys and the difficulty keeping bees off them, or the difficulty in sensitively handling the heavy boxes? Murray McGregor runs over 2000 hives and I think that more than half are on Langstroth mediums, and without QXs at least for the latter part of the season. For the heather flow at least, but I can see that restricting the brood nest to one or two boxes during the swarming season would be sensible.

    I thought that I liked the poly Nationals we bought for the association, but now I think that I don't. Wood is nice.

  5. #15

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    I like the idea of one size but I'd need to know more first - so that'd be on my list, and I have nationals on bottom bee space but I think I'd prefer top bee space instead - again I don't know enough to make a decision. Wish someone had told me the pitfalls of the Beehaus before I bought one. I use it for resting drinks on at a BBQ instead!

  6. #16

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    Biggest consideration as to what hive to buy? What your mates use. Not because they'll "tut" at you, but because its so much easier to give or scrounge a frame of brood from the same frame size as your own. I got my bees as a colony in a very knackered old Smith hive, and continued down the route of buying knackered old Smith hive parts. but have learned a bitter hatred of amending frames to fit nationals when said frame is full of bees, brood, and its piddling down.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Mellifera Crofter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gavin View Post
    What is it you don't like about the Langstroth mediums? Thick walls on the polys and the difficulty keeping bees off them, or the difficulty in sensitively handling the heavy boxes? Murray McGregor runs over 2000 hives and I think that more than half are on Langstroth mediums, and without QXs at least for the latter part of the season. For the heather flow at least, but I can see that restricting the brood nest to one or two boxes during the swarming season would be sensible.

    I thought that I liked the poly Nationals we bought for the association, but now I think that I don't. Wood is nice.
    Hi Gavin,

    No, the thickness of the walls did not bother me greatly. They can be a problem - particularly the MB ones with that extra lip, so bees can't get swept aside easily as you manoeuvre a box into place - but it is more the amount of lifting and stacking of boxes that bothered me. I longed for the simplicity of going through just one box, or two at the most, looking for queen cells. Going through the hive took me a very long time, and that can't be good. The queen ignored the bottom box almost completely and created a brood nest that covered parts of about five boxes - a long narrow brood area.

    Interesting that Murray McGregor uses a one-box system. I would love to know more about his way of working. Perhaps I won't immediately ditch my Langstroths.

    You may like your poly hives when winter arrives. Do you prefer the robustness of wood?

    Kitta

  8. #18
    Senior Member Mellifera Crofter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easy beesy View Post
    I... Wish someone had told me the pitfalls of the Beehaus before I bought one.
    What are they, Easy Beesy (apart from the price)?

  9. #19
    Administrator gavin's Avatar
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    It would be great to get Murray on here to tell you himself, but as far as I can remember:

    Langstroth polys, QX on early in the season for ease of management (QCs in one box or two), taken off in July to let the bees roam through the stack of boxes. The heather harvest is from the upper and the side combs, around the brood nest.

    Wooden Smiths, Smith polys too, presumably similar.

    In general you can persuade queens (and workers) to work out the way and fill the box by delaying the addition of more boxes until they have a couple of frames left.

    Yes, I like the robustness, look and feel of wood. Also the top space design of the Swienty feeders and roofs against the bottom space Nationals and the broad edges on which you can squash bees, these all cause problems. Perhaps if I buy enough crown boards and frames queen excluders I could solve that!

    Gavin

  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by gavin View Post
    It would be great to get Murray on here to tell you himself
    Gavin
    He would have to say that they are easy enough to lift
    When you employ teams of Polish lads and lasses to lift them for you

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