Artificial swarm variants

[gavin]

So, you got your bees last year, you got them through the winter, they are exploding in this fine spring, and then the queen cells start. What now? Hope that they go away?! Cut them out in a panic? Get on the internet to order a new queen as obviously this old one wasn't doing her job right? No, someone said artificial swarm.

OK, there are different flavours of artificial swarm. The first question is ... where is the old queen going (assuming that you can find her, and if not seek help). Some say take the old queen out in a nuc box with a few frames. That isn't my advice because you will then have a populous and queenless colony. Two results:

- the flying bees are now queenless and likely to be tetchy and troublesome
- new virgin queens will take an age to come into lay as they usually do in a populous colony

Here is what I said in an email to a year 2 beekeeper the other day:

1) new box on the old site

2) frame with the queen goes into this having removed any queen cells on that frame

3) if you have any empty comb to spare, put at least one in (the flying bees will need somewhere to dump their goodies, and otherwise you might still get more queen cells because they've no space). Otherwise foundation.

4a) reduce the queen cells to one in the old box (shake bees off but not the frame with the Q cell to be kept - shaking is risky - to make sure you miss none), OR

4b) reduce Q cells to two, leaving still open cells. Leave a week. Move the box to the other side of the original hive if you can. Flying bees join the old queen, box gets depleted, the bees will allow only one queen and she will not swarm due to the depletion, OR

4c) Split the old box into two boxes (or more) with one queen cell in each. Insurance against a failure of mating or hatching.

I tend to do 4c but the others are good too. If 4b then leave only open cells to guard against losing a cast with a virgin, and to make sure that there is a good grub inside the cells.

Doing the artificial swarm this way round ensures that the flying bees (the ones that could cause trouble) are queen-right and so well-tempered. The queenless part has few flying bees.

Also, there could be a risk that either part might starve in poor weather. Leave them honey stores, or feed, particularly if poor weather is forecast.

Any comments folks?

Gavin

[Jon]

I have done all of those variants at one point or the other.

A lot of people have reported that the queen still swarms after having carried out the artificial swarm.
To prevent that you can put a queen excluder under the brood box. Check if they have started queen cells again after a few days and if all seems fine and dandy, remove the excluder.

Some say take the old queen out in a nuc box with a few frames.
- new virgin queens will take an age to come into lay as they usually do in a populous colony

That is one of the reasons I like Apideas as the queen usually is laying 11 or 12 days after hatching.
Trying to deal with a double brood box queenless colony is one of the biggest nightmares in beekeeping.
I find a big colony is ok as long as it has a queen cell but if the virgin queen gets lost on a mating flight you then have a queenless monster to deal with.
Definitely not a task for a beginner.

For those who cannot find the queen, you can put a new box on the original site and set in a frame with a single good queen cell.
Shaking in a few younger bees is a good idea as well but you have to be careful not to accidently shake in the queen.
You then have a queen cell with all the flyers and the queen and the brood in the other box with no flyers so she cannot leave in a swarm.

The other factor is clipping queens.
I clipped queens for the first time this year after hearing too many horror stories about swarms escaping to chimneys (see blog)
If you clip the queen and continue to do weekly inspections you have insurance against missing a queen cell.
Missing a queen cell in a populous colony is very easy.

[Calum]

A big colony that wants to swarm is difficult to stop unless the queen is removed (move the whole colony leaving a brood box with one open frame of brood and the supers on top).
The swarm will usually only be delayed by removing bees and brood.

But I if you have the choice breeding from your best colony is really easy.
Put 5-6 frames of mostly closed brood (+ attending bees) in a brood box shake in 3-4 frames of (queen free) bees.
Move to another site. After 1 week remove queencells and add 10 very young larve (in plastic starter cups is easier for caging later) from your fravorite colony.
The bees have no choice but to raise these to queens.
After 4-5 days you can put on the hair curlers and prepare artificial swarms (in apideas or partitioned brood boxes) for the number of queens that have been raised.
Simples.

This can be repeated 2-3 times.
I got 9 then 7 and 5 = 21 queens from one breeder so far this year using this method. It cost me 6 frames of brood and some more bees+ some liquid feed.
for best results with apedias I use shook bees from the breeder that raised the queens.

[Adam]

Any queen that has been in an Apidea gets clipped and marked before leaving which generally means that you get the queen back some of the time and you get the bees if they do swarm. I sometimes can't find a queen in a big colony for a while, Jons tip is to have a nuc nearby and if the queen is seen on a frame, pop the frame in a nuc as the chances are the marking pen or scissors are not at hand just when you need them. OR you put the queen back in the hive and then find queencells later on during the inspection. Once the inspection is done the queen can go back in on her frame. No need to put her in a matchbox or anything like that as some books say.

If I really need to find the queen and can't I seive the bees by shaking into a box under a queen excluder and a few hours later the bees will have moved up to the brood above the Q/Ex leaving the queen below. If there is one frame of brood below, she will (should) be on there and then the top brood box can be lifted off to do an A/S if desired.


I cut down to 1 open queencell rather than two if I don't use queencells elsewhere. That's on the assumption that there isn't a curled up queencell I've missed between the bottom of the comb and the frame bottom bars.

[Kate Atchley]

Horsley Boards

On the basis I don't have to stick too closely to the topic ... has anyone recent experience of Horsley boards? Have made two and hope to try them out on my two largest colonies ... to use the top brood box as queen-cell rearers, possibly in two batches.

Have read the bumf but practical experience always beats the theory.

Kate

[Adam]

Kate,
the fact that you haven't had an answer probably means no. It's a no from me too.
Dave Cushman's web site has an interesting practice of using the board to give 2 queens in the colony:-

http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cus...orsleyalt.html. Which would be interesting to try.

[The Drone Ranger]

Horsley Boards

On the basis I don't have to stick too closely to the topic ... has anyone recent experience of Horsley boards? Have made two and hope to try them out on my two largest colonies ... to use the top brood box as queen-cell rearers, possibly in two batches.

Have read the bumf but practical experience always beats the theory.

Kate

Michael Badger's BeeCraft article is on this link courtesy of The Beekeeping forum.co.uk
http://idlebeekeepers.co.uk/upload%2...ey%20board.pdf