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Thread: Here we go again!

  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    It wasn't ignored. I commented above that it was interesting and also that it is a lab study.
    Every piece of research helps the understanding of what is obviously a very complicated picture.
    Pesticides may play a part, but there again, they may not have a very significant role.
    Imidacloprid was being used widely in the US 10 years before the first reported cases of CCD.
    Hi Jon

    Neutrality! What neutrality! You must be a Tour de Force when really 'on side'!

    Eric

    Eric

  2. #32
    Senior Member Jon's Avatar
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    Eric. I know you find it hard to believe, but some people actually really are neutral while the jury is out, and can wait patiently for the evidence to come in. I know for many people the world is black or white with no shades of grey but I haven't actually thought like that since I was about 19 years old and that was a long time ago.
    The stuff I am passionate about, like beekeeping, I am very passionate about - but I try not to cut all ties with rational thought.

  3. #33
    Administrator gavin's Avatar
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    I have to say that the DVD was rather good and I enjoyed watching it. It was well put together and it was nice to see the faces behind all those names. Most of it was clear and well-balanced, but they were selective about the people they interviewed, possibly so that they could give it that anti-pesticide spin. The comments on Nosema and imidacloprid certainly chimed with the Alaux paper, but I have my doubts. I'm not saying that there isn't a link, but I have my doubts. There was all that fuss about IAPV which then came to nothing - is this just the same? There were also heavy hints dropped - by Dennis vE I think, according to US beekeepers on Bee-L - that there was going to be something really important coming out on some fungicide which was associated with CCD, but that never happened. The French work is lab studies and the lack of any sensible dose-response curve rings alarm bells. Also the added contribution of the insecticide over and above the already large effect of Nosema on its own wasn't large. For the detail of Dennis vEnglesdorp and Jeff Pettis' results we'll have to wait until they publish them.

    G.

  4. #34
    Senior Member Jon's Avatar
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    Eric.

    Try this one for size.
    I will be interested in hearing your explanation of how they have come to the 'wrong' conclusion and failed to pin the Spanish bee losses on the Pesticide Express.

    Abstract
    This study is presented in order to determine the presence and impact of some factors related with honeybee colony
    losses such as Israeli Acute Paralysis virus (IAPV) and certain pesticides. Samples (house worker bees and stored
    pollen from brood chamber) were selected from one hundred apiaries, half of them with a clear underpopulation, in
    accordance with region and time of the year. Total prevalence of IAPV either in spring or in autumn was 18%
    (CI95% = 9.9-26.0; p < 0.0001), no relationship between IAPV and depopulated colonies was established. Fipronil was
    only detected in two samples of stored pollen from asymptomatic colonies and imidacloprid was not detected in any
    sample. Like IAPV, neither fipronil nor imidacloprid appeared to be directly related with the generalized problem of
    colony death and honey bee losses in professional Spanish apiaries.

    http://www.inia.es/gcontrec/pub/658-...0822149843.pdf

  5. #35

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    Hi Jon, Gavin and all interested parties
    This has been a great platform for airing all kinds of views. I have enjoyed the cut and thrust of freely expressed opinions. The Forum has a great future and I look forward to many more ‘tussles’ in 2011. Let us put our differing views behind us for the present and ‘hunker’ down to a chilly but fulfilling Festive Season with our respective families.

    I wish you all an enjoyable Christmas and a Healthy, Prosperous and Happy New Year. (in the hope that we all still have live bees in our hives when this ‘End of Days’ arctic weather is done with us!)
    Best Wishes
    Eric

  6. #36
    Senior Member Jon's Avatar
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    Cheers Eric.
    It's certainly chilly here. -9 this morning and we have had temperatures as low as -14 this week.
    Make sure you don't sprinkle too much Imidacloprid on your Christmas Pudding. We dont want to see you getting disorientated in the snow.

  7. #37
    Senior Member chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    Make sure you don't sprinkle too much Imidacloprid on your Christmas Pudding.
    Just a wee nanodram

    Enjoy your family Eric

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