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Thread: Morphometry procedures and standards

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    Default Morphometry procedures and standards

    Jimbo,

    I'd like to do that. Rather than go through PM's though can we start a new thread on what we need to do to take samples, how we get the figures and so on?

    i.e I'm standing in front of my hive, what do I need to do next? Is one bee enough, do I need 30, where do I go from here?

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    Senior Member Jon's Avatar
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    Hi Nellie.
    30 is about the minimum, 50 is better from a sampling point of view.
    As the queen mates with 15-20 drones even a sample of 50 may not represent every drone in the mix.
    There are two ways at least to do it.
    The best way is to open a colony, lift out a frame, shake off the older bees and then pick off or scrape off 50 young bees which have never flown. That way you avoid drifters who have entered the hive from other colonies. However, this is not the time of year for messing about like that as you could end up killing your queen so leave that one for next spring.
    What I do at this time of year is take a sample without opening the colony. I take a little plastic container with a lid and place it over a load of bees at the entrance. I then drag it across the front of the box and quickly put the lid on. I gave it a shake to knock the bees to the bottom and then give a quick spray with a mister to wet them and stop them flying out.
    Do this several times until you think you have 50. This is an imperfect sampling method but realistic at this time of year and gives a fair idea of what you have. Roger P has pointed out to me that some of the older bees have ragged wings.
    Next step is freezing them. Wait a couple of hours before putting the sample in the freezer for 24 hours so that the bees clean themselves up a bit otherwise you will end up with a golf ball of frozen bees and water.
    When you take them out after 24 hours, let them defrost on a windowsill in the sun for a while or under a table lamp.
    Make sure they are properly dry before removing wings or you will get a lot of dirt and dust on them which means the scanner might not take a reading. This has happened with some of mine.
    I then spread them out an a plate. I lift each bee by the right forewing and cut it near the body with sharp clippers. The bee body drops away and you are left with the wing you want. I set this in another dish.
    Make sure you dont sneeze or you will blow a load of wings over the table. Yes, I have done that!
    When you have completed this for every bee, cut a small triangle off the corner of an envelope and carefully put the wings inside. Label the sample with the colony number. Seal it with a couple of staples and post to Jimbo.

    I would be curious to see how others take a sample.
    Last edited by Jon; 31-10-2010 at 12:37 PM.

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    To answer a number of your questions.

    To take a representative sample of bees for Morphometry you need between 30 -50 bees. The more bees the more accurate the result.
    To get the bees depends on the time of year. You want preferably young nurse bees as they have come from the hive and there is less likely of drifted bees. In the autumn the bees are likely to be older bees To get a sample I open the feeder hole in the crown board. I tap the board and bees will spill out onto the crown board which I then collect in a box / plastic tube or can use a honey jar. In spring or summer when you can go into a hive. I first find the queen and put her somewhere safe. I take a few frames of bees and shake them either into the upturned roof or a plastic bucket. I leave for a while some distance from the hive. The older flying foraging bees will return to the hive and you will be left with young nurse bees plus a few drones
    which I collect in a container.
    When I have my samples I place in a freezer overnight to kill them. To send the bees for wing morphometry. I take the bees out of the freezer and defost on paper towel. You want to get as much moisture out of the sample before sending then in a cardboard box or matchbox. You don't want to send them in anything plastic through the post as they will turn to mush

    Jimbo
    Last edited by Jimbo; 31-10-2010 at 11:42 AM.

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    There are two good software programs you can download. The Beemorph software you can use for a month on free trial before you need to purchase an access code. Cost me £20.00 a few years ago. The Beemorph uses a normal scanner which you can place all 50 wings on the scanner bed. You then need to plot each plot by hand but the software calculates the graphs for you. We did discovered operator error in placing the points as various beekeepers got slightly different results from the same sample. It also takes more time to do a sample run.
    The other software program is Drawwing which you can download from the BIBBA website for free. There is instructions on how to use it. You do need a photographic scanner with a high dpi. The scanner I use is an old Epson Perfection V100 Photo which I bought on e Bay for £50.
    In my opinion the Drawwing software is easier to use as the computer places the point for you but with the option for you to check and correct any funny results.
    You will also need to download Peter Edwards Morph plot software to get you graphs, again this is free from BIBBA and has instructions on how to use it.
    If you are intrested in this BIBBA is running a Morhometry workshop

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    Two courses coming up:

    Bee Breeding and Morphometry Workshop - 27th Nov, Scotlandwell, Fife. Contact Enid Brown. SBA and BIBBA supported. A world class set of tutors and speakers, including Jimbo! £20, includes lunch. More details will be posted here soon, but there are still a few places available. There will be an extended practical session in the middle of the day which covers wing morphometry and other traits, and the day will have a broader focus on breeding good bees, particularly native types.

    Wing Morphometry Course - 20-21 Nov, Stoneleigh, Warwickshire. Bookings to Dinah Sweet, enquiries to Roger Patterson. BIBBA. Free to members, £30 non-members.

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    I would like to add just a few points. It's best to freeze the bees for 2 days to make sure that none of them "come back to life" when you warm them up again. If you use the latest drawwing version it's best to select "step by step" mode. If not you will get plenty of wings that fail and you will not be confident that the others were assessed properly. I always use nurse bees but I have one beekeeper who does not believe in opening his hives very often. He smears honey on the inside of an empty sardine can and places it, upside down, over the crown board feed hole. When the bees go up to take the honey he puts a film over the top and freezes them. When they get to me they are dead but sticky so I wash them in a colander and dry them on top of our boiler before doing the assessment. My wife doesn't know that I use her colander so no dropping me in it please.

    Rosie

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    Senior Member Jon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    . I first find the queen and put her somewhere safe.
    That is crucial. I know someone who found his queen frozen in the sample after he took it out of the freezer and it was a Galtee queen which he had bought!
    As in any aspect of beekeeping, if you don't know for sure where the queen is, don't do the manipulation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    I know someone who found his queen frozen in the sample after he took it out of the freezer
    A friend of mine did that last season - the plot turned out to be a good one as well. We used the queenless colony as a successful cell starter.

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    Senior Member Jon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rosie View Post
    My wife doesn't know that I use her colander so no dropping me in it please.

    Rosie
    My other half didn't know I had sneaked 7 nucs into the garden behind the shed in the middle of July but she found them the weekend I was at the BIBBA conference in Tipperary and there was a lot of bad talk on my return about lack of consultation!
    Just goes to show native type bees are quiet and no trouble.

  10. #10

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    Nellie,

    As already "advertised" in an earlier post why not come along to the Morphometry weekend at Stoneleigh 20/21 Nov?

    You have my email.

    Roger Patterson.

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