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Thread: neonicotinoids update

  1. #21

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    Its not surprising that insecticides harm insects
    The thing about neonics is persistence in the environment
    Again its not surprising that a proportion of a seed dressing stays in the soil
    Solution is buy only organic fruit and veg etc

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  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Drone Ranger View Post
    Its not surprising that insecticides harm insects
    The thing about neonics is persistence in the environment
    Spot on that is their designated purpose. Persistence is not something restricted to neonics, some pyrethroids have reported half lives of up to 2 years in soils. No insecticides/pesticides are good for bees, but perhaps seed dressing vs spraying might be worth a thought in their application. Spraying does tend to kill pretty quickly whats is underneath the spray.

  3. #23
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    Update:

    https://www.theguardian.com/environm...l-gove-reveals

    Its worth reading the scientific papers cited with an open mind if you can get access.

  4. #24

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    to follow up - Daniel Cressey writes a nice piece in today's issue of Nature (https://www.nature.com/news/the-bitt...icides-1.22972) on the issue. I've passed the details to the SBA magazine editor in case it can be reproduced there. The article is very accessible though a bit depressing. The combination of a highly complex biological problem that has not been particularly well addressed in early investigations, self and financial-interest, entrenched attitudes, sloppy journalism....

    Bit like Scottish football I suppose.

  5. #25
    Senior Member Greengage's Avatar
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    Looks like your minister is a sheep in wolfs clothing. https://leftfootforward.org/2017/11/...ut-not-others/

  6. #26
    Senior Member fatshark's Avatar
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    Surely you mean 'wolf in sheep's clothing'?

  7. #27
    Administrator gavin's Avatar
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    I'd settle for a wolf in wolf's clothing.

    But on the neonic thing, there have been a slew of papers in the last couple of years that show worrying things like significant contamination around fields - and also bumble bees managing to gather pollen with relatively high levels of neonics. It might be some of them that changed Gove's mind (and those of his advisers).

    Bramble and creeping thistle were particularly high (foliage was tested).

    https://www.sussex.ac.uk/webteam/gat...t-env-2016.pdf

    Here's another paper that shows that bumble bees (but not honey bees, particularly, with that explained as possibly them foraging over a wider area) can end up with contaminated pollen in their nests at higher levels than you might expect from the known levels in crop pollen.

    http://sro.sussex.ac.uk/59217/1/Draf...ur%20David.pdf

    Here is Jerry Wright's work that could explain a tendency for bees to collect the more contaminated sources. Goulson's team didn't discuss this in their paper but it could explain the results:

    https://www.nature.com/articles/nature14414
    Last edited by gavin; 14-11-2017 at 02:28 PM.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Greengage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fatshark View Post
    Surely you mean 'wolf in sheep's clothing'?
    Quote Originally Posted by fatshark View Post
    Surely you mean 'wolf in sheep's clothing'?
    Yes your right I have too many wolves in sheep clothing over her at the moment so bit pre occupied. Who ever thought beekeeping could be so divisive. A lot of these reports I read seem to have Dave Goulsons name attached. While I enjoy reading his material. He seems to have a chip on his shoulder against Monsanto and other chemical organisations. He did start a Bumblebee conservation group and increased awareness of the contribution of pollinators to the environment, But I wonder what his attitude would be if he was been funded for his research by some of the chemical groups he opposes. As an ordinary Joe soap I have to read all these conflicting ( I don't have to read them but I'am curious and like to be informed) reports and try to make sense of them. I'am interested but when I discuss the issues with friends and family they just blank it one minute you want to ban glyphosate and neonics next your telling me the alternatives are worse, then your talking about food security and the contribution of pollinators to food but if we go to the local super market there is nothing there pollinated by insects from either Ireland or England, last week Tomatoes from Spain, Apples from New Zeland, Blueberries America, Onions Portugal, Spuds Israel?? garlic China Carrots Spain and so on and on. All the cereal is wind pollinated wheat oats, but wait I found a small pack of four cookers from Northern Ireland.

  9. #29
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    Virtually all the wheat will have been sprayed with glyphosate to kill it off prior to harvesting, some think theres a link to increased levels of ibs in the population, either way it certainly makes less flowers available to pollinators.

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