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Thread: neonicotinoids update

  1. #11

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    http://www.beeculture.com/catch-buzz...s-wildflowers/
    Worth a read if like me you were inclined to discount the effect on bees of treated seed
    My thinking was that if bee lifespan was shortened it would recover later
    I'm not sure that is true now

  2. #12
    Administrator gavin's Avatar
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    The original paper came out last year and does include that incredible claim that 97% of the neonics entering a colony comes from the vegetation around arable fields:

    http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/...nalCode=esthag

    There was a response from the industry but I can read neither article without shelling out:

    http://pubs.acs.org/doi/pdf/10.1021/acs.est.5b05729

    Anyone with access want to comment? I'm finding it somewhat counter-intuitive that 97% comes in from wildflower sources.

  3. #13
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    http://www.sasa.gov.uk/sites/default...pe_2015-16.pdf

    Survey summary released by SASA on Scottish Winter Oilseed Rape Cultivation 2015/16: Impact of the second year of Neonicotinoid Seed Treatment Restrictions

  4. #14

  5. #15
    Senior Member fatshark's Avatar
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    A big study.
    With big variation.

    Taken together, our results suggest that exposure to neonicotinoid seed treatments can have negative effects on the interannual reproductive potential of both wild and managed bees, but that these effects are not consistent across countries. The country-specific responses of honey bees and bumble bees strongly suggest that the effects of neonicotinoids are a product of interacting factors.

    You could surely flip this round to suggest banning the - as yet unknown - interacting factor to avoid the detrimental effects ... if you were from Syngenta (which I'm not).

    High profile and lots of exposure certainly, but I'm not sure the it makes things much clearer, at least for honey bees.

    What do you think GG?
    Last edited by fatshark; 30-06-2017 at 10:05 PM. Reason: full stop missing - call me a pedant if you must

  6. #16
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    No access to full paper unfortunately.

    What disease control did they use? Strange that they allude to different disease levels in German hives vs. UK/Hungary and then identify pesticide exposure as the culprit.
    Why the high winter mortality in the UK? Same question as above arises.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by James O View Post
    Why the high winter mortality in the UK? Same question as above arises.
    Piss poor beekeeping seems as good an answer as any. The UK mortality rate recorded was iirc over 50%. As that is at least double the UK norm.. either the bees were rubbish or the beekeeper was.

    If the bees were rubbish, the study for the UK is invalid...

    So let's imagine neonics are banned. What are we going to replace them with? Organic? At a time when UK farmers claim to be short of labour? Not plausible or realistic.

    As everyone is so quick to ban things, but not propose a realistic substitute, I fail to take the arguments seriously..

  8. #18
    Senior Member Greengage's Avatar
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    I give up, there are so many confusing reports its difficult to know what to know. http://static.producer.com/wp-conten...052.1499065068
    We are involved in a number of studies here on site with students. Looking at Varroa control, Sub species of bees, Urban forage, and medicinal benefits of bee venom. I was telling a friend about these and he suggested that a BSc was Bullshit, MSc More shit continued and PHD Pile it high and deep sometimes you have to wonder where all these reports and studies are going there must be vaults and vaults of them some get legs and others just disappear. Lots of kids ( they seem to be all kids with no experience of life maybe I am getting to old) come out of collage after completing these totally disillusioned and no idea where they are coming from or going too. No that's not true the last three students we had are off on a gap year to Indonesia and something about a disco on a beach to see the sun rising or is it setting ah well maybe they are right.

  9. #19
    Senior Member Jon's Avatar
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    Apparently the bees used in the UK part of the study were nucs rather than full colonies.
    Also, different fungicides were used in the 3 jurisdictions of the study so that is another variable it failed to take account of.

  10. #20
    Senior Member busybeephilip's Avatar
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    Probably easier to manage nucs. Anyhow its got Jullian Little from Bayer scratching his brain to come up with a new alternative (Long time no see Jullian if youre reading this ,JAP)

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