Oxalic Acid Pan Evaporator 12 Volt

[gavin]

I agree with every one of these points Calum. (The grown-up kids still come along especially at Christmas.) However in the UK we have Prof Ratnieks saying that sublimation is much better for the bees and declaring that everyone should convert from trickling. Given the increased risk to the beekeeper I think that advice is most unwise when your audience will be thousands of beekeepers. See the next Scottish Beekeeper if you get that.

I've still been wondering though, and reading all the ingenuity with interest. As I'm now building up numbers, devices that take 5, 6, 7 minutes to go through the whole cycle would be a bit of a bind. Trickling is really fast. The flip-over tray type sublimators might compete in terms of time but the need for a rinse after Api-Bioxal (liked your mention of that on the videos DR ) would scupper that.

Am I right that in Germany you have a properly registered (and relatively inexpensive) oxalic acid solution for Varroa control? We're now being forced into using Api-Bioxal which recommends a much higher concentration than we're used to.

Do most beekeepers in Germany trickle?

[Pete L]

As I'm now building up numbers, devices that take 5, 6, 7 minutes to go through the whole cycle would be a bit of a bind.

What I use takes 25 seconds.

Below is an interesting thread on the commercial section of Beesource.

I think I treated over 1700 hives in a day all in the holding yard worked good time will tell if we got a good kill though .. I think our mite levels were low to begin with do some more checking in texas

Gave her another go today. We did 3 yards... 220 pallets. Worker was at the house at 9 this morning. We were back before 4. There was maybe 75 minutes of total travel time. We did check the yard we did yesterday just to relax my worker's head. He wanted to make sure we had not fried a bunch of bees. All looked good. We stuck some sticky boards in some. All in all this is a fast system. We were able to do the first yard of 140 pallets in 2.5 hours as opposed to yesterday 70 pallets took 2 hours. We just had a little more experience and knew when to keep our eyes open. As long as we get the good mite kill, I would give it my full endorsement. I can keep you guys posted.

http://www.beesource.com/forums/show...or-mites/page4

[fatshark]

I'm afraid I can't agree with the "it's more dangerous" stance. Oxalic acid is a poison - whether ingested or vaporised. With both you must take appropriate precautions. If you do - don't drink it, don't inhale it etc then it is not dangerous to the operator. I see the point that Calum is making re. 'trustees of nature'. First impressions last, as they say. However, dribbled OA is more dangerous to unsealed brood than vaporised OA. We might look better dribbling (so to speak) but we're actually probably doing more harm to the bees/larvae in the colony. I'd prefer to present a well-argued case that I'm using the best possible treatment to minimise mites and the damaging viruses they transmit, rather than using something I (now - having used both) believe is sub-optimal.

I also like showing people around the apiary, but I don't necessarily think that doing so during the application of treatments is the best time to do this.

Finally, it's not clear that Api-Bioxal leaves any residues in the Sublimox-type 'active' vaporisers. OA certainly does not, though the instructions recommend rinsing at the end of treatments (not per hive). I'm well aware that there are unspecified additives in Api-Bioxal. I expect to be vaporising Api-Bioxal in the next couple of weeks and will report back ...

[gavin]

.... additives in Api-Bioxal. I expect to be vaporising Api-Bioxal in the next couple of weeks and will report back ...

That would be most interesting ... and useful ... thanks. There is a VMD meeting planned in 6 weeks or so which will touch on this and other aspects.

Api-Bioxal has glucose and powdered silica I believe (and 'added value' ) as well as OA.

[fatshark]

Glucose and powdered silica are outrageously expensive additives ...

[The Drone Ranger]

This is a nice civilised thread
I like madasafish's hand crafted item
The profession equipment for sublimation is faster but you need a lot of hives to justify it
If trickling does kill some brood that's bad but it implies the queen is laying so they will be replaced presumably
There should be no fumes coming out of the hive during sublimation
After the 7mins or there about you can remove the entrance foam on a cold day no fumes will appear

So everybody is right and wrong in equal measure I would say because the advantages of each method have been stated but the disadvantages are being overstated strangely
Oxalic is dangerous yes but not overly so
Nail polish remover, diesel, petrol you name it, are dangerous in some context

Reading this Back it seems a bit pompous but I hope you can see what I am getting at

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[mbc]

20160105_124841.jpg
My battery operated gas heat gun, unfortunately it doesn't have enough oomph to sublimate oxalic on its own, however:

[mbc]

2016-01-06 10.33.56.jpg

Coupled with a 12 v heat pad made into a crucible with some sides, put into a clip box with lid and a fire cement base, an exit spout and a hole for the heat gun, I have a portable forced gas sublimator. This is mark 5.3 and works reasonably but I'm already working on mark 6.0 which will hopefully be even betterer.

[Kate Atchley]

... There should be no fumes coming out of the hive during sublimation ... So everybody is right and wrong in equal measure I would say because the advantages of each method have been stated but the disadvantages are being overstated strangely ...Sent from my LIFETAB_S1034X using Tapatalk

I agree. With careful application, no vapours escape and I haven't felt I was at risk at all while I was doing the treatments ... indeed the mask was belt and braces given the absence of fumes.

As for the mask, I use the one shown below, as specified in the Varrox bumf: an FFP3. Worn under a veil, even with eye protection, it is not very obvious or alarming to onlookers. However, I wouldn't advise having children anywhere near OA whether you're trickling or sublimating.
IMG_0344.jpg

[The Drone Ranger]

Reading a well known American site
Half way through the "scientist" decides to vaporize some oxalic and deliberately inhale the fumes ?????
Here's a quote from the Oxalic pages
"The Europeans have tinkered with oxalic acid quite a bit;"
Everything on his site re oxalic nicked straight from Europe then that statement amazing really

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