Rebecca and Ged Marshall on the beeb

[SDM]

If its all about succession planning then its simply a way to get govt. Subsidies for your kids wages for those with established businesses.
I thought it was to bring" new" people to the industry. We no a broad gene pool is good for a species, but apparently not for beekeepers ?

[gavin]

You don't get a finishing salary in self-employment, beekeeping or otherwsie, you find inventive ways of making things happen and making ends meet, just as mbc described. Folk with a passion to do something find a way, and all this scheme does is help.

Government subsidies?! Where on earth are the government subsidies? This is 100% industry funded as far as I can see.

Two Ps in apprentice .

'know' not 'no'

'kid's wages'

misplaced "

There's even a misplaced capital.

[mbc]

The NZ milk industry has a proud history of providing a route in for new blood and succession for the old through a milk share scheme during handover. I can envisage something similar for retiring beefarmers who don't have interested family, a crop share during the handover year/years. Maybe something useful the bfa could do would be to facilitate a bridging loan or insurance in case of crop failure during this time.

[SDM]

You don't get a finishing salary in self-employment, beekeeping or otherwsie, you find inventive ways of making things happen and making ends meet, just as mbc described. Folk with a passion to do something find a way, and all this scheme does is help.

Government subsidies?! Where on earth are the government subsidies? This is 100% industry funded as far as I can see.

Two Ps in apprentice .

'know' not 'no'

'kid's wages'

misplaced "

There's even a misplaced capital.

Sorry there's a glitch on my phone where if I erase it just keeps inserting more and more words or parts of.
I'll try and edit as I go.
It obviously not clear since Gavin thinks they will be immediately self employed and others think they'll be retained on a wage.
I think before we discuss both options more we should know which it is, because I don't.

There are various grants to the training provider from the govt.
So in the case of British honey producers , Rebecca's father was paid for the trouble of employing someone(that he already did) who didn't need the training in the first place.
At the very least, this is a questionable and not very auspicious start.

[SDM]

You don't get a finishing salary in self-employment, beekeeping or otherwsie, you find inventive ways of making things happen and making ends meet, just as mbc described. Folk with a passion to do something find a way, and all this scheme does is help.

Government subsidies?! Where on earth are the government subsidies? This is 100% industry funded as far as I can see.

Two Ps in apprentice .

'know' not 'no'

'kid's wages'

misplaced "

There's even a misplaced capital.

Sorry there's a glitch on my phone where if I erase it just keeps inserting more and more words or parts of.
I'll try and edit as I go.
It obviously not clear since Gavin thinks they will be immediately self employed and others think they'll be retained on a wage.
I think before we discuss both options more we should know which it is, because I don't.

There are various grants to the training provider from the govt.
So in the case of British honey producers , Rebecca's father was paid for the trouble of employing someone(that he already did) who didn't need the training in the first place. If you add to that the fact that she was her father's accountant before she started the scheme(I believe)
At the very least, this is a questionable and not very auspicious start.

[prakel]

It obviously not clear since Gavin thinks they will be immediately self employed and others think they'll be retained on a wage.
I think before we discuss both options more we should know which it is, because I don't.

Will surely depend on the individual, just like those twenty something's that take a degree in one subject and then transfer skills into an (apparently) unrelated career. Some will no doubt become beefarmers while others will gravitate into different spheres.

Meanwhile, of those who continue with the bees a lot will probably want to use their experience and qualifications to work for large enterprises abroad, others may find that they're encouraged to stay on with the business they've been apprenticed to (isn't that a common route with this modern apprentice scheme in other sectors?) while finally, some may be in a position to go it alone but as someone who's experienced life at the hard end of self employment I reckon that the best way to do this would be by building up colony numbers (at least a core unit of good stocks) and some of the ancillary gear during the term of the apprenticeship. Sure it's hard to do that on a very low wage but I think that the apprentice will never have a better opportunity to hear of bargains or to do deals with an employer.

So, I can't see how there can be any hard and fast rules. People's aspirations often change with time.

All of that said, I do follow your questioning as to whether it is turning into more of an in-house scheme rather than a way to encourage newcomers into the industry maybe because it's easier to find suitable candidates within the employers existing network. But that's something which'll work itself out in time anyway.

[mbc]

At the very least, this is a questionable and not very auspicious start.

I dont see why you're picking holes, the new scheme needed rolling out and I cannot believe any financial help from UK gov will have covered set up costs let alone made a profit for those involved. This is a patently good thing in my view and to have it in place can only be of benefit to the industry as a whole.
I regularly have people offer to come to work for me for nowt for the learning experience and invariably I turn them down as anything that inconveniences me or slows me down at key points can cost big time in the future. I sometimes let them know this and offer to let them come and work like a dog for a few days for a reasonable fee of £250/day if they're really keen.

[The Drone Ranger]

Morrisons Supermarket ran one of the biggest apprenticeship schemes just lately
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17584151
Someone working on their fish counter would suddenly become an apprentice and Morrisons would benefit
So SBC has a point (if that's what is happening in this case)

[gavin]

It obviously not clear since Gavin thinks they will be immediately self employed and others think they'll be retained on a wage.

No, I said presumably that is the career path. Perhaps I should have said the ideal career path, and I didn't specify whether or not they may get experience elsewhere first.

So in the case of British honey producers , Rebecca's father was paid for the trouble of employing someone(that he already did) who didn't need the training in the first place. If you add to that the fact that she was her father's accountant before she started the scheme(I believe)
At the very least, this is a questionable and not very auspicious start.

According to the information on the BFA website, which you appear not to have read, the host *pays* the apprentice.

[SDM]

The NZ milk industry has a proud history of providing a route in for new blood and succession for the old through a milk share scheme during handover. I can envisage something similar for retiring beefarmers who don't have interested family, a crop share during the handover year/years. Maybe something useful the bfa could do would be to facilitate a bridging loan or insurance in case of crop failure during this time.

Agreed, but that doesn't seem to be their aim not according to their own blurb at least.
And surely the loan would also need to cover setting up 200 bives and all the things you'd need plus of course your first year wages.. That's a massive debt for a Beekeeping startup.