What happens next? The Bees probably know but they're not telling...

[SueBee]

Last week I had a busy hive with a queen with clipped wings (my first bees, a nucleus bought last year). Today I find queen gone, a new (and so far virgin I think) queen and the hive stuffed with bees.
I'm worried, should I make an artificial swarm with the new queen, or wait until she has mated, or just leave them to get on with it?
She certainly won't be lacking in mates - plenty of drones about.

I have a spare hive ready just in case...

Sue

[Jon]

I'm worried, should I make an artificial swarm with the new queen, or wait until she has mated, or just leave them to get on with it?
Sue

Hi Sue.
The idea of an artificial swarm is usually to prevent swarming and yours probably swarmed over a week ago. Fortunately your queen was clipped so you only lost the queen rather than half the bees.
Did you see the queen with clipped wings last week and if not when was the last time that you saw her?
Have you been checking weekly?
What was the situation re. queen cells. If there are still sealed queen cells in the box and it is packed with bees, you will almost certainly lose a swarm headed by one of the virgin queens which hatches.
If there are more queen cells, I would remove them but make sure there is still a virgin in the box. Easy to say but they can be hard to find.
If you want to make two colonies and there is still a queen cell you could make a split leaving the virgin with the bees on the current site and putting a queen cell and some brood and bees on a new site.
What was the state of the brood? Were there eggs? What age were the youngest larvae. This can tell you approximately what date the hive swarmed by counting back to the date the last egg was laid.
I am assuming that you saw the clipped queen recently and that the queen you saw is not a supersedure queen from last year.

PS don't move the box with the virgin in it. If she has already flown and orientated, she will not be able to find her way back home after a mating flight.

[SueBee]

Thanks Jon,
The old queen was definitely there during weekly check last week, she was marked. Since there are so many bees, I guess they swarmed and came back?
Couldn't see any sealed queen cells yesterday, just queen cups. I'll check the hive again today and also assess eggs and larvae.
I marked the new queen yesterday so I should be able to find her. If there are further sealed queen cells, I might take them off with brood and bees to another site.

Lesson learned - make weekly check less than seven days rather than more!!
Sue

[gavin]

Hi Sue

It might be the case that what you are seeing is supercedure, but it is hard to judge from this distance. If you don't have queen cells (there must have been at least one), and the old queen has gone, and there is a new one in her place, that could be what has happened.

[SueBee]

Thanks Gavin, been into the hive today (damn but its hot in a bee suit in this weather!). The new queen is still there, running around, HUGE amounts of bees, the brood box and half of the super were stuffed!

Normally quite docile, they were a bit agitated today. Also a queen cell, with larva, close to closure I think (but remember only my first May with them) and several queen cups (couldn't see anything, but eyesight not brilliant at spotting eggs or small larvae). Is it normal to have a lot of drones at this point? I guess once new queen gets to flying and mating, a lot will disappear.

So I have taken new (only) queen on frame, frame of brood, two frames of feed and put her in a new hive next to the old one. Just hope I have done the right thing and not wrecked the colony?

Sue

[Jon]

Hi Sue
If you have a virgin queen you should never move her until she has flown and mated. If she has already flown once and orientated to the other hive she will reenter that original hive when she flies to mate.
If you want to make up a new colony take some brood and adhering bees along with a queen cell.
I am not sure what you should do now as it depends whether the new queen has already orientated or not.