New Queen (I think) but no drones

[Mellifera Crofter]

Mel I had kept an old queen ...

Nemphlar, I guess you're warning me to assume that my hive is queenless. I got cold feet myself, and yesterday 'sieved' them all through the queen excluder (as gently as I could - brushing the bees into an empty broodbox with QX above and brood nest above that) - still no queen. I have always been able to spot a queen when necessary, and I have now gone through this hive so many times and still did not see her. I also know that the mother queen is gone and that one virgin queen died. I was just nervous that there might be another virgin queen. I think I'll now unite them (but not with one of my queens from Jon).

I'm surprised to see so many of you are still doing inspections - weather must be alot kinder elsewhere. ...

No, FD - I've long since stopped inspecting the hives - since about the first week of August, but I opened them all again in the last week of August to add Apivar strips and check their stores. That's when I discovered I have a hive in trouble. It's been cold and windy up here a lot of the time.

Kitta

[The Drone Ranger]

Hi kitta.
Sorry to hear you have queenless hive after all.
After a while of being queenless I think they are very short on nurse bees.
Some stuff I have read suggest field bees can switch back to nursing but only about 10% do.
When you might have a queen and you do the QXcluder paper combo you hope the bees will unite and share hive resource including nurse bees from the colony with laying queen.
I'm with you though I would unite with another colony because even though replacing the missing queen is possible the bees are all probably over the hill (like me)

[Mellifera Crofter]

Thanks DR. I still have some bees emerging from that hive, but that's because I have twice added frames with eggs to see what will happen - and nothing happened. Normally that means there's a queen - but I think it's too late for that test to be accurate.

I thought you mentioned the queen-excluder way of uniting as a way of being cautious just in case the 'queenless' hive does have a queen - or did you mean two queens in one combined hive? Sorry for being a bit confused now.

I've got a hive prepared with a QX and a laying queen. I'll unite them tonight and check again after a week - just in case there's a queen in the top! One more chance to spot her.
Kitta

[Jon]

I have never heard of it being too late to draw queen cells if a test frame is offered to a queenless hive.
A colony with laying workers will often fail to draw queen cells on a test frame.

[Mellifera Crofter]

I did wonder about that, Jon - but this colony was never without brood, so I did not think laying workers would develop. Well, they were at times without eggs or larvae and with just capped brood (like now). Do you think that is enough for them to develop laying workers?
Kitta

PS: I added the first test frame not long after the queen mother would have disappeared. There were still some very young larvae, but they did not make use of that test frame or the one I gave them later.
K

[The Drone Ranger]

Hi Kitta.
I have searched for a queen same as you and not found her.
Had no laying.
So used the Qx + paper trick and after a while lo and behold ,laying above and below the excluder. Many times over the years.
I marked a queen today in a hive I was getting ready to do something about because no laying and hadn't been able to see queen
I see what you mean because you have been adding test frames there will be bees of all ages.
I spent a while looking for a queen in a keiler double mininuc yesterday for a queen no joy.
Found her easily today though
She is long and slim carnie type would she do you or are you going Amm ?
She is laying well

[Jon]

You should see patchy looking drone brood and multiple eggs in cells if there are laying workers.
The colony should be ok if it has always had brood.

[The Drone Ranger]

Between tapatalk fat fingrrs and android touch keyboard I gave up trying to make the last post readable.
If you need a queen you can have this spare she is carniolan ish and laying
I havent figred out how to PM somebody on this tapatalk yet.

[Mellifera Crofter]

Thanks DR! I'll send a pm.
Kitta

[Mellifera Crofter]

... I asked for advice and was told it's too late for test frames to be accurate ...

... I have always been able to spot a queen when necessary ...

I have never heard of it being too late to draw queen cells if a test frame is offered to a queenless hive. ...

You're right, Jon - there was a queen! So my two test-frame results were accurate!

I also have to apologise for my assumption that I can spot a queen when necessary. Or perhaps not ... I was about to release DR's queen in my hive when I thought I'll look a final time - and found her - so, when it was necessary! She had to be sent off to bee heaven and replaced by DR's queen (but I hate regicide).

I've taken over your thread, Rowie. How are you getting on? And please note my warning that a test frame might be too late was wrong.
Kitta

PS: I just realised that that doesn't follow. If a hive really is queenless in September, and there aren't any drones about, will they still make queen cells?