Winter loss survey 2012/2013

[The Drone Ranger]

DR - I've lost the comment so not quoted. You mentioned/implied use of formic acid as a VD treatment (quiet at the back of the class!) in the West being more prevalent than in the East. Where did you get that info from? I do think that if formic can penetrate sealed brood then might be useful as spring treatment so I'm thinking about it. If our Westie friends have some info on this I'd be interested to hear.

Well its just a supposition and its based on old information really
I haven't had the SBA mag for a year but most of the articles, advice, and recommendations for using Formic Acid treatments came from Eric McArthur who I think its fair to say also championed Oxalic acid

I am scared of Formic because its highly corrosive and need careful preparation and handling

Why?

Well one day I decided to mark a queen using a little bottle of Thorne's Queen marking fluid and a small stick
So out comes the frame with the queen, on goes the marking cage ,and my marking eye is in -- job done!
Only now I'm so pleased with myself I forget the bottle is still sitting on the edge of the open brood box, I knock it into the hive, and end up with dozens of marked bees all masquerading as the queen.
The moral of the story is "If things can go wrong they will" and if that involves acid they might go very wrong indeed
Most treatments you can just jump right in, but I think Formic might be one where getting some good advice first could matter

this sounds a bit preachy when I read it back so I'll just add " with a hey nonnie noh !" to lighten the mood

[The Drone Ranger]

Those new MAQS strips are based on formic aren't they?

They are,wonder how much they cost?

[Jon]

Very expensive. I think it was something like £9 per colony

Edit

Thorne press release on MAQS

[The Drone Ranger]

Very expensive. I think it was something like £9 per colony

Bit steep -- formic is pretty dear to buy by the Ltr as well though.
It's one of those things I leave to the experts (and there aren't many of them)
I don't want to end up like this

[Calum]

I worked out it costs about 45p a colony to do the formic and oxalic treatments.
If you use 60% formic its not that agressive (i avoid the 80% treatments as I see they damage the open brood too much).
Oxalic solution with sugar is a doddle if you by the preperation pre mixed.

I believe these are subsidised medications (by the EU) so should be cheaply available though associations (at least they are throughout germany).

[Jon]

We mix up the Oxalic and sugar in our association for members and gave out about 6 litres in December.

[gavin]

I believe these are subsidised medications (by the EU) so should be cheaply available though associations (at least they are throughout germany).

That's interesting. One of the choices in the Scottish Government's recent consultation on spending EU funds was this option. It sounds as if it is a subsidy open to all beekeepers in local associations?

G.

[nemphlar]

[QUOTE=The Drone Ranger;17300]Bit steep -- formic is pretty dear to buy by the Ltr as well though.
It's one of those things I leave to the experts (and there aren't many of them)

Bonymans of Ayrshire will do FA at £20/5litres. Pound shop will do Tupperware dishes and sponges for dispensing. Having tried thymol as an autumn treatment last year that stopped the queens laying, I'll go back to trying a mid year formic treatment.

[The Drone Ranger]

[QUOTE=nemphlar;17346]

Bit steep -- formic is pretty dear to buy by the Ltr as well though.
It's one of those things I leave to the experts (and there aren't many of them)

Bonymans of Ayrshire will do FA at £20/5litres. Pound shop will do Tupperware dishes and sponges for dispensing. Having tried thymol as an autumn treatment last year that stopped the queens laying, I'll go back to trying a mid year formic treatment.

I haven't bought any for years so I'm sure you are right I was robbed, and now the unused bottles are in negative equity--depressed
If thymol doesn't float your boat that's fine by me I don't have any shares in Thornes

[The Drone Ranger]

Just for clarity
I bought formic acid some years ago from Lindchem who appear to have been taken over since so that will tell you how long ago it was.
I think it was £8-50 per bottle which was 500ml of 85% lab grade Formic acid
There was £20 delivery by special courier on top

If folk are using it and they like it and get it cheap thats great

I am a the sort of person who managed to get thymol in the eye when just adding it to syrup
That leads me to conclude Formic might be better left to the expert user

I tried it on a couple of occasions and thought what a palaver absorbent boards, diluting acids, hole punching plastic bags, wooden strips over brood frames, Ekes to make room under the crownboard,sealing the hive,checking the temperature to calculate dosage --
I though this is not for me and I'm sh--t scared of the stuff when I'm handling it

I'm not saying anything about whether it works or doesn't and it appears you can buy it cheaply by the gallon now
So if folks like it and wan't to use it great knock yourselves out when nothing else works I'll be joining you

What I am saying is I think there is a difference between the varroa treatments used on the East Coast of Scotland and the West could that be a factor in colony losses
They are collecting this data at Dundee as well so we could just wait and see I suppose