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Thread: Scottish MEP calls for ban of neonicotinoids

  1. #21
    Administrator gavin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stromnessbees View Post
    .
    Dr Connolly is now demanding the centralised recording of data so that the "multiple threats" to bees can be analysed properly.
    And he wants the Scottish Government to take action to address the issue.
    Well, Dr Connolly, to be speaking to the Parliamentary Environmental Audit Committee, the Beeb, the Scotsman, and the Peebleshire News on this, his chosen subject, will surely have checked his facts first? Is it true that there is no recording of data on pesticide use across Scotland? Or is it just OK to make stuff up because it sounds good?

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    Administrator gavin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stromnessbees View Post
    That's an insult to all experienced beekeepers who lost colonies due to no fault of their own.
    Clearly you are scraping the barrel with your arguments.
    OK Doris, did Dr Connolly record the experience levels of the people responding? If not, why not?

    Did Dr Connolly record the levels of Varroa in the surveyed colonies, ideally in autumn? If not, and considering the evidence from most studies of colony losses elsewhere that this is always the big one, why not?

    Did he record the strength of colonies going into winter and the levels of stores in the colonies?

  3. #23
    Administrator gavin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stromnessbees View Post
    Only partially correct, there are other influences besides money.

    [on Drumgerry challenging your comment on Biobees that the main beekeeping fora are run by people in the pay of the pesticide companies]

    They certainly do their best to create that impression.
    Doris, this is what you said on Biobees. Could you please explain whether you now simply think that 'they do their best to create that impression', or whether you still believe the following as posted to Biobees:

    Yes, this is outrageous!

    By now the pesticide corporations are in charge of all the major beekeeping forums, akin to foxes running the hen house.

    Our freedom of speech has been taken away, the most important discussions moved behind closed doors or severely censored.

    People, if you don't stand up against this, then you deserve the corporate dictatorship that we are heading towards, with all food produced by Monsanto & co, as we will be unable to grow anything for ourselves, with all the bees and other pollinators soon gone.

    It's up to you!

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    Banned Stromnessbees's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gavin View Post

    OK Doris, did Dr Connolly record the experience levels of the people responding? If not, why not?
    ...
    As I said before: you need to ask Dr. Connolly about that, not me.


    Quote Originally Posted by gavin View Post
    Doris, this is what you said on Biobees. Could you please explain whether you now simply think that 'they do their best to create that impression', or whether you still believe the following as posted to Biobees:
    ...
    Gavin, you forgot the link to my quote - it's always better if people can check out the context for themselves:

    http://www.biobees.com/forum/viewtop...?p=91583#91583



    Getting back on topic:
    Gavin, I hear you had some colony losses yourself this winter.

    Would you mind telling us what exactly happened, your varroa control, proximity to neonic treated OSR, etc? - After all you are in the East, which was significantly harder hit with colony losses this winter.
    Last edited by Stromnessbees; 10-03-2013 at 01:48 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stromnessbees View Post
    Wherever Colony Collapse Disorder (CCD) has turned up, it was in conjunction with the use of neonics, usually in agricultural areas, but sometimes near orchards, golf courses or parks which were treated with these pesticides.
    I know that there's a small army of people out there that try to confuse this basic fact, but I think I know where they come from.
    All the best bee scientists in America have been trying to get their name at the top of the paper which fingers the culprit of CCD and yet they couldnt make this link with neonics, which suggests to me that its a load of crap you,Stromnessbees, have made up to suit your agenda.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mbc View Post
    All the best bee scientists in America have been trying to get their name at the top of the paper which fingers the culprit of CCD and yet they couldnt make this link with neonics, which suggests to me that its a load of crap you,Stromnessbees, have made up to suit your agenda.
    Surely you are not trying to say that it was down to me that Europe is now wanting to ban these chemicals in order to save the bees?

    - I think you over estimate my influence.
    Last edited by Stromnessbees; 10-03-2013 at 02:11 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stromnessbees View Post
    Surely you are not trying to say that it was down to me that Europe is now wanting to ban these chemicals in order to save the bees?

    - I think you over estimate my influence.

    No one plausible is calling bee collapses in Europe CCD as far as I'm aware.
    Maybe your influence with BigEco is persuasive, who knows ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mbc View Post
    No one plausible is calling bee collapses in Europe CCD as far as I'm aware.
    Maybe your influence with BigEco is persuasive, who knows ?
    You are right, they call it 'dwindling away' here, but it's just the same.
    - I prefer to call a spade a spade, if you know what I mean.


    There is no such thing as BigEco, the billion dollar industry is the one that sells the pesticides.

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    Senior Member Jon's Avatar
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    Winter dwindle has been reported for centuries though, before CCD, before neonicotinoids, before any pesticides for that matter.
    It can be caused by varroa mite, tracheal mite, nosema apis, nosema ceranae, queen failure, inbreeding, weather related factors, poor nutrition in the build up to winter, and/or virus. take your pick.

    Claiming that most cases of dwindle we see today are CCD is a tad disingenuous to say the least when there is nothing more than a personal opinion proffered - and diagnosis is carried out over the internet in most cases.

    Even in the US where CCD has actually been recorded many cases of dwindle are likely to have other explanations.

    CCD has been found in areas of pesticide use and in areas with little or no pesticide use such as Dee Lusby's 'organic' beekeeping operation in the Southern US.

    Noone has demonstrated any correlation between areas where neonicotinoids are used and areas where CCD occurs.
    In fact, there appears to be no correlation at all.
    That's not to say there are no dangers associated with neonicotinoid pesticides - clearly there are risks, but there is no correlation at all with CCD.

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stromnessbees View Post
    After all you are in the East, which was significantly harder hit with colony losses this winter.
    Doris - I'm in the "east" as well and haven't lost a colony. Makes a nonsense of the arbitrary division of Scotland in this way.

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