Poly hive musings.

[Mellifera Crofter]

The only slight concern I have about the Swienty boxes I bought is the lack of a rebate on the bottom of the box to leave space over the frame lugs when you have a double brood. Do they get propolised together badly? ...

Yes, Fatshark - horribly so. I escaped the problem with double brood because I discovered the propolising problem before I had my bees on double brood.

The top box (the super in my case) got propolised onto frame lugs in the bottom one which meant all the bottom frames lifted up as I lifted the top box. Twisting the box did not help to free them either. The bees were understandably furious by this kerfuffle.

I now cut the plastic lug rests down by about 2mm to create a bit of space above the frames.

Kitta

[fatshark]

Grrrrr. The bees are of course in the boxes in which the frame rest would have to be trimmed. Maybe I'll use a cedar box on top. If they're strong enough to need a second box they should be OK temperature-wise. Ho hum. Something to tackle next season

[Mellifera Crofter]

(?) Trim the lug risers in the new box; move the bees over; trim the lug risers in the old box - and add it as the top box. But trimming the lug risers by a sliver is easy for me because I have a bandsaw. I can see that trimming them might be more difficult if you don't have a bandsaw.
Kitta

[gavin]

I now cut the plastic lug rests down by about 2mm to create a bit of space above the frames.

Thanks Kitta. I'm likely to tackle some double brood Swienty Nationals back from the heather either this afternoon or tomorrow.

2mm sounds a bit small so I've just been playing with empty boxes and agree that is about right. Beats gluing 'bee space rims' on the undersides of my Swienty poly feeders. The lack of top space together with the flat roofs and feeder bottoms does also cause problems with Swienty Nationals. No issues with top bee space hives.

The lug riser plastic L-pieces have a lift of 17mm (the inside leg measurement). Used as intended all but 6mm of that is used up because the slit is 11mm down the wall.

So frames are lifted 6mm.

A brand new Thornes top bar (DN4) sits about 0.5mm below the edge of the box. A layer of paint (and varnish if that is your way) might increase that slightly.

In other words there is 6.5 to 7mm to play with and your 2mm off would be about right to split that gap into two - about 4mm under the lugs and maybe 3mm above them.

Is 3mm enough of a bee space to avoid squashing and inhibit propolising?

Assuming that L-shaped plastic trim is usually measured on the outside edges 15mmx10mm trim would be ideal. Haven't yet found any online ...

[James O]

The only slight concern I have about the Swienty boxes I bought is the lack of a rebate on the bottom of the box to leave space over the frame lugs when you have a double brood. Do they get propolised together badly? Mine only went into the boxes a few weeks ago so won't go up to double brood until some time in the dim and distant future ...

PS Solway Bee Supplies also sell 'em ...

Go for 14x12 and problem solved.

[Mellifera Crofter]

... Is 3mm enough of a bee space to avoid squashing and inhibit propolising? ...

I think it helps, Gavin - but now I'm watching out that I'm not squashing drones below the lugs! But that's fairly easy to watch out for.

I spoke to somebody who said she is advising Swienty on their Swienty Nationals and she couldn't understand why I have a problem with the lugs. As for me, I can't understand why she can't see that there is a problem.

Swienty aren't only ones failing to provide a space above the frame lugs. I have a similar problem with Maisiemore nucs. With them I now cut out the integral polystyrene lug rise - so they end up being just a flat lug rests. Also not ideal.

(None of these problems with Abelos.)

Kitta

[Mellifera Crofter]

Go for 14x12 and problem solved.

You mean you don't have to use double broods? But you still have the space problem between the brood box and the super - except if you use queen excluders, I suppose, and I mostly don't.
Kitta

[James O]

You mean you don't have to use double broods? But you still have the space problem between the brood box and the super - except if you use queen excluders, I suppose, and I mostly don't.
Kitta

Yes, I should have been more expansive. I always use queen excluders.
I find that 10 frame swienty national brood are too small for most colonies, double brood I find too big and a pain when doing routine inspections. 14x12 works well for me as it provides enough room and inspections are more straightforward, so long as they have drawn out the foundation to the frame edges.

[The Drone Ranger]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SMITH-Hive...AAAOSwxg5X0yuS
You wont squash bees in these Smith hives just spotted them on Ebay £113 inc delivery
s-l1600.jpg

[alancooper]

Just seen an ad on e-bay for a black plastic bee hive wrap. A quick "google" shows they are used with wooden hives by some in north America. A drawback seems to be condensation. Has anyone in SBA experience in using them?