Poly hive musings.

[Dark Bee]

Why? Dead bees Dark Bee that's why!

That is what I do not understand. Insofar as I can make out from the photos, the integral feeder is essentially the same as a "traditional" frame feeder. In the latter a float /polystyrene packing beads / mesh on feeder walls can prevent fatalities - so why cannot these techniques be used in this nuc feeder? I'm probably being very obtuse and the reason is obvious. So I'l lhave one brought over sometime and do my own investigations (in my own specially constructed laboratory)

[drumgerry]

Dark Bee the reason why a frame feeder is better than an integral one in my opinion is that a frame feeder can be removed and cleaned up. Any dead bees in the integral feeder can only be removed with great difficulty and generally a foul dead bee/syrup/fondant goop results which can be removed only when you have no bees in the nuc.

[Black Comb]

I see Modern Beekeeping have their Langstroth nucs on offer at the moment - £29 each. Thinking of taking a punt on a couple and adapting for Nat frames. Anyone used them? They look very nice on the website but looks can be deceiving.

http://www.modernbeekeeping.co.uk/it...h-nucleus-hive

I've run MB poly nucs for several years and like them. I run jumbo LS, also have some Swienty LS standard size. the MB standard LS are exactly same as jumbo but shallower.
The MB ones are from Paradise Honey and are well made. They have a separate floor with mesh. They have a lip between floor and body and between body and roof. This lip is good in nucs but I would not like it in a standard hive as things like crown boards and QE could prove messy.
The nucs are six frame and have an entrance at the back and front, allowing you to run 2 x 3 frame if you wish. Or you can buy a pre-cut piece of correx from them as a separator.
In use I find them good. Also, the service from MB is generally good too.
They also sell a top feeder specially for these nucs (I have one but am yet to use it).
Painting - well MB advise that all poly contains minute cracks which over time will allow a little water ingress and when it freezes.........
Also, 2 coats of masonry paint inhibit UV degradation. Doesn't take long.
The separate floor is a bonus over the Swienty ones, meaning easier to clean.
You can also purchase special entrance closures/reducers, one for each end. Can use gaffer tape at one end of course.

2 pieces of plywood and 4 screws should convert them to nationals. As stated, you could use the gap at one end as a feeder.

[Dark Bee]

Dark Bee the reason why a frame feeder is better than an integral one in my opinion is that a frame feeder can be removed and cleaned up. Any dead bees in the integral feeder can only be removed with great difficulty and generally a foul dead bee/syrup/fondant goop results which can be removed only when you have no bees in the nuc.

Thank you for the elaboration Drumgerry. What you say makes sense and is quite obvious now. Swi-bines also have a fixed food chamber, but are more accessible and q-cage fondant may be used which would eliminate the drowning problem. It will be interesting to see what changes Paynes make to the design in light of the consumer opinion. I would suspect very little as the cost of new moulds must be phenominal.

[The Drone Ranger]

Thank you for the elaboration Drumgerry. What you say makes sense and is quite obvious now. Swi-bines also have a fixed food chamber, but are more accessible and q-cage fondant may be used which would eliminate the drowning problem. It will be interesting to see what changes Paynes make to the design in light of the consumer opinion. I would suspect very little as the cost of new moulds must be phenominal.

Hi Dark Bee
You are right to change the design would be hard
If you look at the integral feeder the rib on the inside of the hive is very thick
That's good for strength but that thick web comes up to the roof and crushes bees
so by adding a bolt on piece to the injection mould that rib could be lower by just over a bee space
That saves a bread knife mod to the rib
alternatively a remould of the roof could allow for a crown board that would be very welcome
The material is very dense, and they are great for the money, don't need painting, so could be the only sensible choice with some tweaks

[gavin]

The new version has a sheet of thin perspex with them which I like as it allows you to usher bees to safety before the lid goes on. The picture on the Paynes site doesn't show these improvements.

It also has a different entrance which implies the mould was changed - no longer the slot at the base but a hole part of the way up the side with one of these birling disks to allow queen exclusion/inclusion, ventilation only, or just shut. Better for keeping mice out.

I agree the rib is fat but it gives insulation in the winter from cold feed if you still have any, and the perspex sheet stops you crushing bees (with a little care). You wouldn't want to drop the rib by a bee space as currently you can insert a queen excluder or just a total excluder in the depression, shutting off the feeder entirely.

I like the new version and may get a few more if it is in the autumn sale.

[brothermoo]

It's actually a tool that is made for each design... Ten to fifteen grand I was told by their manufacturer when looking into poly rose osb's.

Roger Payne had a big outlay! The entrance is cut from the main design so it was easier to change

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[gavin]

Thanks BM, didn't realise they were cut out.

I like the new version and may get a few more if it is in the autumn sale.

Especially as a couple of spots of lemongrass oil made a mess of one of my four!

No further adventures with the stuff to report tonight

[The Drone Ranger]

It's actually a tool that is made for each design... Ten to fifteen grand I was told by their manufacturer when looking into poly rose osb's.

Roger Payne had a big outlay! The entrance is cut from the main design so it was easier to change

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Maybe the SBA could design one and raise the money charitably to pay for the tool
Then churn them out till they get the money back

[robin118]

I have two of the paynes nucs the older ones with the slot entrance. I think in general they are ok but I do not like the internal feeder. My mane gripe with them though is I think the roof is too thin it should be thicker giving more insulation.