Queen cells with royal jelly in week 2 of new hive.

Hello,

Having just had a nucleus of bees installed in my first national hive nearly 2 weeks ago, I was surprised and alarmed to see about 5 longish but unsealed swarm cells all along the bottom of one of the original nuc frames at my second inspection today. I opened two with my hive tool to find a load of white gunk, which I first took to be a squashed larvae, but after a bit of research I now believe it to have been royal jelly, probably with a small larvae that I didn't notice.

My queen is still present, that's for sure, and I saw some larvae in worker cells. Thankfully she's been clipped and so she can't swarm, but still not sure what to do with these queen cells. Also, why would they swarm? The foundation I gave them is being drawn out nicely on the two frames either side of the nuc frames. The nuc frames are also getting extra comb built on the base, so whether there's just not enough room for brood and that's why they're wanting to swarm - I don't know. New stores have been capped above the brood that was already there - probably just from the sugar syrup I've been feeding them.

Would be grateful for advice!

Thanks

Hi Mike

I think that you have it. Without drawn foundation and maybe with lots of food blocking the laying area they're feeling a little cramped and have decided to split. You could try removing all QCs and crossing everything you can, but that may cause them to make more cells, faster, and then swarm when they are part-drawn (ie *very* quickly). Best way forward, in my view and if you can, is to split off a frame or two with the old queen and leave only one QC behind. If a new queen gets mated and lays fine then you can recombine or possibly build up both.

G.

Thanks Gavin, I'll do that then, but I'm a little worried that the two small hives won't last the winter. How soon could I recombine them do you think?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mike_maple

Thanks Gavin, I'll do that then, but I'm a little worried that the two small hives won't last the winter. How soon could I recombine them do you think?

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Your selected cell will be sealed in perhaps 3 days, take another 8 to hatch, then if the weather is good (and there are local drones) the queen may mate and lay in a fortnight (or perhaps a month). So you could have a new queen laying at the start of August. Give it perhaps 2 further weeks to settle in and produce sealed brood before you recombine. You'd have to remove the old queen from the split first.

If the new queen doesn't get mated within a month and the old queen is still going then remove the new one and unite. At that stage I'd give them a quick squirt of air freshener (in both boxes) to aid peaceful reuniting.

The split that gets at least a couple of frames of brood and the flying bees (I'd make this one the one that raises a new queen) should continue to build reasonably well. The other one will shed bees back to the other box and grow less well. Either give them more bees than you would like to stay, or block them (in the shade, given the weather ahead) for 3-4 days. The presence of the old queen in this box will help hold some of the bees there anyway.

Gavin, you're a star - that's really helpful. Just to confirm, no need to move the hive so that the nuc with the old queen can be placed in that spot (like I've seen before when reading on how to do an artificial swarm), but in this case as you say, the flying bees should go back to the hive. So the nuc should just be placed somewhere nearby, in the shade if blocking in. OK, so there are 5 frames with sealed brood, I'll put 2 with the old queen, leaving 3 in the hive. I'll give each one a partially drawn out foundation and then fill in with plain foundation frames. Sound about right?

Thanks again for the help and tips!

I would not be feeding at this time of year.
I think it does more harm than good.
I don't feed swarms and they draw comb just fine.
There is an abundance of nectar and the bees will draw out foundation as they need it.
If you feed they will just clog up cells with sugar syrup.
They take anything they are offered.

Hi Mike

Sounds about right :).

Split the brood either 3-2 or 4-1 with the old queen getting the smaller deal. Really all you need is to keep her going as insurance.

I have been housing swarms in Paynes nucs, giving them perhaps one fill of the feeder to help the comb building, then leaving them alone for a while. Seems a reasonable compromise and I think it helped in our cold early June.

G.

Thanks both.
I fed them because they had 5 frames almost totally full of brood but no stores, and the guy who sold them to me (also the lead tutor on the practical course I'm on) suggested that it would be insurance against them starving. Perhaps though I fed them over eagerly, putting more syrup in the feeder every couple of days, leading them to store it in cells that could have been used for brood. Lesson learned!

A little bit of light feeding is fine but continuous feeding in summer will create problems.
If you are sure the queen is still there I would be inclined to knock down the cells and monitor very closely for a while.
If there are enough bees you could make up another insurance nuc as Gavin suggests.