Listen yourself and make up your own mind
Quote:
Originally Posted by
gavin
Yet another country apparently facing bee poisoning from contamination at maize seed sowing time. How come the problems in Europe and more recently in the US *don't* induce the regulators and the companies to act before this happens?
It is inconceiveable that the companies involved didn't know about the earlier problems in Europe. From the testimony given it is plain that the Canadian farmers are still using air seeders that blow their exhaust skywards rather than down onto or into the soil as is required in Europe.
I can only recommend that everybody listen to this recording himself as Gavin is not giving you the full picture there. :(
These beekeepers are very clear about what's happening, this is not only about planter dust but also about colonies killed by the systemic action of these pesticides.
There are plenty of problems from neonics here in the UK too, but the authorities and dominant Beekeeping Associations are remarkably quiet about this.
:confused:
UK colony losses increased
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jon
Such as....
Don't forget to provide some evidence.
Last year the BBKA published an average national winter loss of 13.6 colonies with the following comments:
Quote:
This is the fourth consecutive year when BBKA members have reported unacceptably high colony losses which is especially puzzling when the weather should have been in the bees favour, but it does show how fragile the health of honey bees is.
Periods of poor nutrition within the active season from February to October remain a likely cause of weakness in adult bees that could cause them to succumb to diseases they would otherwise shrug off.
http://www.bbka.org.uk/files/library...1308824156.pdf
The World At One reported today that average colony losses have risen to 16.2 % over the last winter.
Report here:
http://www.bbka.org.uk/files/library...1339663845.pdf
No problem then?
The fact that bees succumb to diseases they would otherwise shrug off is a clear hint at sublethal neonicotinoid poisoning, these products are working exactly as intended by Bayer: 'Premise Plus Nature' causes diminishing grooming behaviour, colonies (of termites) succumb to secondary infections.
Colony numbers upheld against tide of losses.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jon
In the past 3 years uk colony numbers in the uk have increased from 40,000 to over 120,000 according to the bbka.
That is how badly our uk bees are doing. Numbers have tripled.
Who knows where they came from. Outer space maybe.
You can make a strong colony into 4 good nucs in August and have 4 full colonies by the following May.
What you are demonstrating here is that even major colony losses to systemic pesticides can be compensated by production of nucs at apiaries that are not affected by the pesticides yet and with the help of imports from abroad (... rather than outer space).
Luckily this seems to be the case, but this situation is far from being normal and sustainable.
In the past, beekeepers would make 2 to 3 nucs if they had 10 colonies, to cover against winter losses and lost queens. Now it seems to be necessary to take the same amount of nucs into the winter as the number of colonies, as lots of nucs and colonies just dwindle away.
And just to repeat what was said many times before:
neonics predispose colonies for secondary infections and parasites, and affected colonies cannot defend themselves against varroa anymore due to their compromised defense systems.
BBKA calls colony losses 'unacceptably high'
Repetition seems necessary when minds are shut.
I obviously need to repeat what the BBKA said about the 2010/11 winter losses of 13.6%:
Quote:
This is the fourth consecutive year when BBKA members have reported unacceptably high colony losses...
I assume the BBKA have good reasons to call these losses 'unacceptably high'.
This winter's losses were higher still!
Damn statistics and financial interests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
beeanne
I don't see proof of anything in that. Are you not both arguing about nothing? The figures are nothing other than "lies damn statistics and misquotes" or however it goes.
You are right, of course.
As soon as there are major financial interests involved, important figures will be stretched or shrunk in order to achieve a desired picture.
In this case the financial interest is enormous. Just imagine the loss to Bayer if neonics were banned immediately!
That's why we need to look at all the figures available, examine them for their authenticity and try to interpret them correctly.
BeeL: not every contributor seems neutral & independent
Quote:
Originally Posted by
drumgerry
My advice - subscribe to BEE-L and read the archives carefully and at length.
I have been reading BeeL for quite a while:
Unfortunately it also seems to have a certain number of prominent posters which claim to be neutral interpreters of science, yet when you dig a bit deeper you'll find that they are not so independent at all.
:(